Online'Dating' scam issues - all is not what it seems (Or?)

[KenKalico]

Topic: Online dating pitfalls, annoyances, aggravations. Possibly much worse? The unexpected "traps" while trying to meet a good woman.

Question: What is really going on?

I believe that the moderator just placed a new thread that talked the typical messages, letters that come from the Ghanian or Nigerian prince, woman, out-of-luck traveller, etc. The woman abroad who asks for money right away in a very transparent way.

In this thread I would like to see a more thorough discussion.

Obviously online dating is now HUGE business. Big money. Lot of participants. And I suspect this is all ripe territory for nefarious Asians, Russians, Ukranians, Romanians, etc. who are not women per se, rather online hard core hoodlums looking to scam personal ID data, names, addresses, occupation info, etc. Is this not the bigger business? (The date site is just a front for online ID theft or the date site does little to thwart this)

What seems to be the trend in the manner in which it occurs once the unsuspecting male/man has registered at a web date site and begins to try to contact suitable women:

1. Man gets flirt and relatively weak get-to-know-you messages from women with about 20% completed profiles.
2. Man replies just because he wants something for his money and thinks, "Well, why not? This is why I am here online. I have to try."
3. Eventually it leads to a request for online chat though messages are always very brief.
4. This accompanied right away with the requests to go video with the chat and to send digital (email attachment) photos; she'll send the man some photos to lower his defenses (guard). Or messages that badger the "guy" to post more photos to his profile.
5. All the while, emails that begin to include hypertext links in them, things she wishes for him to view in her emails. What exactly are these hypertext links?
6. A real push to use Yahoo IM (InstantMessenger) chat or Skype chat. (note that Skype chat has camera photograph capability)

I'll convey more in a later post. For now, this will do. I think that those who have had similar experiences will follow this pattern. Your impressions, gentlemen? What is really going on?

[abufarsi]

been around for a while...

If you pay, you are a customer and a target. If you do not pay, nobody is interested in your money.
Lots of women from 3rd world countries can't really afford to go to a cafe and while away the hours chatting with some lonely guy. They need help.

yes, there are scammers out there, but nobody in their right mind would continually send cash for items that are low priced.

There are scammers in every dating scenario, they have got us all for a little or a lot. Such is life.

[jadegil6]

Quote: What seems to be the trend in the manner in which it occurs once the unsuspecting male/man has registered at a web date site and begins to try to contact suitable women...

Most online dating sites are designed to make money by charging a fee for the men to join in order to get in contact with the women....but there are some sites that are totally free, and do not gather any information from the men who visit them. I know of one. lol

[Edwin]

Quote: What seems to be the trend in the manner in which it occurs once the unsuspecting male/man has registered at a web date site and begins to try to contact suitable women...

Most online dating sites are designed to make money by charging a fee for the men to join in order to get in contact with the women....but there are some sites that are totally free, and do not gather any information from the men who visit them. I know of one. lol

Yes, and that one is a quite a bit above the others. I am thankful, not for me, but for those who are in need of this, that there is a site such as jaderune.com, and Michael does a great job of safe guarding the site from improper use and from the scammers. Thank you, Michael, for all your selfless efforts that you put into this site for the good of all who participate in it!

[jadegil6]

Thanks you Sir Edwin for your kind words, but it isn't altogether a selfless effort, because I do get the immense satisfaction that comes through doing something to help others, and that is a reward of it's own.

[KenKalico]

Let me be more specific, and then I would appreciate it if gentlemen here would share what they know from experiences.

We know:
1. Online dating is big. The desire to pursue Asian women by western men is big. Filipinas are high on the list of desirable females for relationships.
2, All this offers untold opportunity for the criminal mind.
3. A web dating site profile can be complete fiction or just 30% or 50% true. The pictures could be easily obtained from some other online social networking site and posted as one's own.
4. The 'person' behind the profile is a male completely uninterested in 'dating.' Or it is indeed a woman, maybe even one somewhat resembling what is in the profile. But she is not interested in man-to-woman relationships. She is either fully part of the criminal activity or hired to do her part.

No, I am not talking about the very obvious requests for a man to Western Union 'send' money to the woman in the Philippines. No.

I am talking the more subtle crimes of identity theft. Because -- over time -- the man will/could reveal his name, age, location, occupation, interests, maybe former jobs, month of birth, and photos. Do not underestimate the value of legitimate photographs. Headshots, closeups.

I firmly believe that there is far more money in ID theft and the many criminal possibilities it offers, far more money than just getting 2,000 Euro or 3000 US$ from a man foolishly duped to send it wired to Manila, Cebu or Davao.

And I submit that this has gotten all very sophisticated. They know to be patient now, to 'court' a likely male over time. They are astute enough to know that if you send a barrage of invasive questions within the first half dozen mails, this will warn off an alert 'mark.'


MIchael, please take this question and querry the right way: You are the moderator here and the administrator of this site, I believe. However, unless you are personally in the Philippines screening -- in person -- the women who post photos and personal data here, there is no way to verify veracity, or? Or maybe the woman's information is fairly close, but the email address and the emails sent will be read by someone else entirely?

And so it is with ALL dating sites. Much, much more so for the really big ones for sure. Yes, the site web dating administrator is not doing it purposely to open a venue for cirminals, but the door is wide open for the criminals and they take advantage.

I submit for discussion here that this is BIG business in Asia, Manila too. These are full-scale operations with resources and many 'employees.' This is cyber crime with, yes, some amatuers in the mix. But there are real pros invovled.

I welcome thoughts and experiences.

[Edwin]

Thanks you Sir Edwin for your kind words, but it isn't altogether a selfless effort, because I do get the immense satisfaction that comes through doing something to help others, and that is a reward of it's own.

You are welcome, Sir Michael, and I am happy that you have rewards for your efforts in helping others, and that is wonderful that you contribute that to others!

[jadegil6]

I personally think that to believe that the majority of women on any dating site are not really honest, sincere women looking for a mate is extreme paranoia, and anyone who believes that has been reading (or writing ) too many fiction stories...
The common advice from almost every dating site is to NOT send money to someone who you have never met in person. And the majority of men who start courting a woman online these days usually have Yahoo Messenger of Skype video chat with them, and they get a better knowledge of the person with whom they are communicating.
I would think that identity theft would involve knowing a person's social security number, or driver's license number or some other critical information in order to set up some credit account. It would also probably require an address inside of the country where the credit was to be established, and where the man lived, and not such an easy task to accomplish.
The two biggest dating sites in the US are eharmony.com and match.com, and they have millions of profiles between them, and neither do any types of background checks on any of their members. There are lenghty applications to be completed, but no formal background investic=gations that I am aware of. Could those compaines be fronts or tools for identity theft rings? There are also hundreds of online dating sites for every country on the planet, and if you think they do any background checks for the people whose profiles they publish, then you are mistaken.
One of my close female friends had her profile published (without her consent) by Loveme.com (aka A Foreign Affair) and it appeared on 45 websites that I know of simply because she went in for a free photoshoot one afternoon. They did eventually remove her profile after she sent them a complaint email, but it took 2 months. All of the websites she appeared on were all affiliates of Loveme.com. The information in her profile, other than her first name, was false. Could that be a front or a tool for some identity theft ring? That company is the largest one in the foreign bride business in the world, and it operates out of Arizona in the US. It was highlighted on 60 minutes about a month ago, but there was no mention of identity theft in the storyline. The companies that sell information about foreign women to men in the US are required to do a background check on the US men, but that check is for sexual crimes only. They are not required to do checks on the women. The US companies that sell information to US citizens about other US citizens are not required to do any background checks on their members, male or female. And that fact was the biggest complaint by the owner of Loveme.com in the tv interview because he said it was totally unfair to require him to do background checks to run his business when the US operations did not have those same requirements.
Could identity theft be a possibility in any online dating site? Yes, of course it could happen. The best thing to do is to keep your private information private, and after you meet the lady you are courting, then you can make the decision as to whether to share that information with her, or not.

[jadegil6]

For all of you who are worried about identity thefts, the news that made the headlines two days ago was of the identity theft ring which was arrested in Brooklyn, New York, and whose members had been stealing credit card numbers from their customers, buying goods, and reselling the goods. Those members of the theft ring were employed as bank tellers and waiters in restaurants, among others.
So I guess if you are paranoid about identity theft that maybe you should stop going to restaurants and banks, too.
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